CHF Canada: Co-op Talk

This blog is hyper-lined to additional information. Some information is currently under review, and some links may be broken at this point in-time.

 

In Ken's view, CHF Canada Co-op Talk was established in 2000 and was deactivated in March 2013 due to very low traffic in the public area of Co-op Talk discussion boards with the exception of the private staff meeting room.

 

From the Archives of CHF Canada: Co-op Talk, some selected messages posted for your review: 

 

ANONYMOUS posted message on January 21, 2004 

"Can someone please tell me, do the by-laws of a co-op over ride policies and procedures? If something is not written in the by-laws can the board enforce it?" 

 

ROBERT A. WISEMAN posted message on January 21, 2004 

"First you must follow the laws of the province/country. Next you need to be sure you are not violating any provision of your Articles of Incorporation. Then you check your by-laws and if none of these contradict Board policies the Board can do pretty much as they wish."

DAVID HOWARD posted message on February 25, 2005 

"To return to the issue of outside arbitration and board behaviour, I would like to say in response to Stephen that my experience is that co-ops routinely resolve disputes satisfactorily without any help whatsoever."...

 

"But what to do about boards that get out of control and the sectors role?..."There is no "Co-op Police" even though that might seem desirable sometimes." 

 

ROBERT A. WISEMAN posted message on February 25, 2005 

"Thank goodness there are no "Co-op Police". That isn't what co-operation is about. We take the time to look for broader solutions for the most part. That is why I favour the idea of an ombudsperson rather than arbitrator."..."I also want to echo what David said about forgetting to be positive."...

 

ROBERT A. WISEMAN posted message on February 28, 2005 

"I just wanted to add a word of thanks to everyone who is participating in this discussion. It is great to have a forum to raise really key issues and debate them openly."...

 

"In the same vein, it has taken personal experiences and witnessing how off course things can go to understand that there are real injustices happening in some co-ops. We can say as a movement that there are only a few of these instances and we don't need to address them. We can say that the exception of a few bad apples proves the worth of the barrel of good apples. It doesn't feel right to me though, to leave good people struggling through difficult issues of injustice without there being a sector response that is meaningful. I would hatr to see some politician get it into his or her head to legislate some mechanism to address these problems."...

 

"For me I think an ombudsperson is the answer. Any other ideas...?" 

 

KEN HUMMEL posted message on February 28, 2005 

"Hello everyone; I'm new to the Co-op message board, but have been a member of a Co-op since 1992. I feel that it is time to commence a derivative action against director's and officer's at the Co-op. I have made every effort to find a solution to the remaining outstanding issues with the Board..."...

 

"the auditor is not co-operating. I had contacted the Police, CMHC, and Minister Fontana (Ya, it's a long, long story). Director's and officer's have been accused of corruption and incompetence. The misconduct and dishonesty is outrageous."...

 

STEPHEN PIPE psted message on March 1, 2005 

"Dave, the stuff about Legal disputes was a generality and not about Co-ops in particular. The courts are full of examples where intervention, mediation, arbitration and other forms of dispute/problem resolution have failed. 

 

In the absence of a Board willing to ask for help resolving their member problems or problem members, it seems the Courts are our only recourse. See the posting above from Mr. Hummel as a case in point. As individual members, who care about what is going on and want to make things better for everyone, we stand alone and must fight for justice. Otherwise, we become just another disgruntled "move out". How many people have had to leave their homes and communities because they don't have the resources to know and fight for their rights? Do any Co-ops do MEMBER EXIT INTERVIEWS? I wish Mr. Hummel every success. We, the members, apparently need the media/political exposure and legal precedents."...

 

"This has always been about the "bad apples". ...      

 

ROBERT A. WISEMAN posted message on April 2, 2005

"I am very concerned by your posts Ken. It was good of you to fax me the documents that you said you would, but what a disappointment given the serious allegations you repeatedly make on this forum.

I expected to see police reports that confirmed that their investigations found fraud, given how often you accuse staff and board members of this crime. It is clear from your materials that you have contact the police.

I expected to see a damming report from CMHC and even some indication that they would be taking action to rectify the terrible abuses you accuse your co-op of perpetrating.

What do I see?

Page after page of accusations produced by you without any evidence at all. You can write hundreds of accusations out Ken, but at some point there has to be a simple thing called evidence for your allegations. I see none!

I don't understand how you can time after time come on this forum and accuse your co-op of the things you do when, in a letter signed by you and faxed by you to me you state:

"It should be noted that once Ms. Lori M. Wheeler assumed the position of Office General Manager and Co-ordinator as of September 8, 2000 most of stated (sic) infractions of the Act's, and Co-op by-laws have been corrected. I believe the administrative and organizational skill Ms. Wheeler demonstrates in the overall management of the Co-op is exemplar, and her dedication to the Co-op movement. In my opinion Lori demonstrates Leadership, Integrity, and Perseverance."

I have never suggested that anyone posting to this forum be precluded from doing so before, but from what I see posted here there is no real evidence for anything but the administrative slips that an overworked staff person and voluteer board might from time to time make.

The fact of the matter is that you don't appear to have been able to prove anything. You don't have the support of your fellow members and so you are bringing this garbage to Co-op Talk, smearing the reputation and good name of your Co-operative and taking up a lot of good space here that would be better spent on positive matters that build this movement."

KEN HUMMEL posted message on April 3, 2005

"Response to Robert: In regards to your two posts on April 2, 2005- around 10:52 pm. Consider the following facts: I still live at this Co-op 5-years after making serious accusations and allegations, and I have not been evicted or had any legal action commenced against me by the Co-op in regards to any of my statements or accusations.

Evidence: I have documentation that exceeds 1,000 pages, my documentation and brief synopsis outlines some of this evidence that was supplied to you, and you fail to acknowledge this. Robert, don't mislead people in this forum by misrepresenting anything that I have stated. Robert stated "I expected to see police reports that confirmed that their investigations found fraud, given how often you accuse staff and board members of this crime:. Robert, I never made any accusations of fraud, only allegations. The Police turned their investigation over to CMHC.

Robert stated "I expected to see a damning report from CMHC and even some indication that they would be taking action to rectify the terrible abuses you accuse your co-op of perpetrating". Robert, it is obvious to me that you don't understand the time-line that I presented in my documentation and synopsis. Between September 8, 2000 when the new office manager and coordination was hired and prior to me contacting CMHC on February 6, 2004 & March 20, 2004, I provided the Co-op plenty of time to correct many of the issues that I had made accusations and allegations.

Robert stated 'but from what I see posted here there is no real evidence for anything but administrative slips that an overworked staff person and voluteer board might from time to time make". Robert A. Wiseman, you're statement is totally outrageous and ridiculous when you consider my posts on March 31, 2005-6:03 pm, April 2, 2005-10:31 am, and April 2, 2005-11:20 am.

Robert, you should be concerned about my posts because it is my opinion that "YOU" can't handle the truth, and it appears that you prefer to ignore or dismiss problem boards or Co-op that I discuss here. Robert would just play it safe and spend his time focused only on positive matters."

ROBERT A. WISEMAN posted message on April 3, 2005

..."Now Ken, you come on here and make all kinds of nasty allegations against your co-op. In fact, you sent me a letter that you sent to the Durham Regional Police on February 13, 2004. That was a year ago.

I want to note that if the 1,000 pages you claim you have are like the roughly 23 pages you faxed to me, 950 of the pages are written by you outlining what you believe is wrong, the other 50 would be documents that acknowledge receipt of your letters or outline why what you 'demand' is'nt going to be forthcoming.

Again I repeat...you have sent me  NO EVIDENCE, only allegation after allegation. I look at your posts cited this date and again, NO EVIDENCE.

Ken, I say this reluctantly, but nevertheless as positively as I can - put up or shut up."

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

KEN'S COMMENTS IN REGARDS TO MR. ROBERT A. WISEMAN'S MESSAGES

AT THE POINT-IN-TIMES THESE MESSAGES WERE POSTED, IT WAS NOT NECESSARY NOR PRACTICAL TO SUPPLY THE EVIDENCE TO ONLY ONE PERSON THAT APPEARED TO BE NOT NEUTRAL AND AN ADVOCATE FOR CO-OP HOUSING.

CHF CANADA AND THE ADMINISTRATOR'S OF CO-OP TALK DELETED SOME OF MY POSTED MESSAGES, SUSPENDED MY POSTING PRIVILEGES AND SOON AFTER BANNED ME FOR LIFE FROM POSTING MESSAGES ON CO-OP TALK.

SINCE THAT POINT-IN-TIME, I (KEN) HAVE POSTED MUCH OF MY **EVIDENCE** ON KEN'S SITE FOR EVERYONE TO VIEW AND MAKE THEIR OWN JUDGEMENT IN THE COURT OF PUBLIC OPINION.

SINCE I (KEN) **PUT UP** THE **EVIDENCE** AND ONGOING PROBLEMS AT THE HOUSING CO-OP, 

MR. ROBERT A. WISEMAN HAS **SHUT UP**

 CLICK HERE And CLICK HERE to access links to other information

 

 DAVID HOWARD message posted on April 18, 2005 

"The site administrators will remove all postings listed in my April 15, 2005 list. Some people have requested that the posts be edited for content. Editing the posts was considered, but will require more time and resources than I can offer this site as a volunteer. The postings listed will be moved to another hidden string and can be replaced if enough members request it. 

 

Moreover, all postings from Ken Hummel where he has made allegations of illegal or immoral behaviour on the part of his co-op will be moved. His postings that were an attempt to provoke argument for its own sake have also been removed. 

 

Moreover, I have asked our staff to have  Mr. Hummel disqualified from posting here in the future. It has become very apparent that Mr. Hummel refuses to accept any direction from the moderator or from other members here. I believe that his postings are libelous. Moreover, I think he is simply trying to be disruptive and finds it amusing to annoy the other members at this site. 

 

I think that we have all been very patient with the tone and content of the postings at this site in recent months. In fact, I would go as far as to say that we have been too patient. In the future, I will try to be quicker to act when it comes to anti-social behaviour at Co-op Talk. After all, this resource belongs to all the members and we need to reclaim this space." 

 

DAVID HOWARD posted message on April 19, 2005 

"Apart from Mr. Hummell, no one else has lost their right to take part in these rooms. If anyone wants to restate previous points from postings that have been removed, I hope they will feel welcome to do that. Of course, I know that these members will be mindful our new approach to these discussions as stated in some of my earlier postings. 

 

Peace" 

 

STEPHEN PIPE posted message on April 19, 2005 

"The tribe has spoken! Fair enough!"...  

 

KEN HUMMEL posted message on December 16, 2005 

"Ms. Robson: My posed message 12/15/05-10:13am. You have only answered only 2/6 of my questions. Please try once again, and answer all my questions. Thank you. 

Have a nice day." 

 

DAVID HOWARD message posted on December 16, 2005 

"Ken, 

No one here is obligated to answer every question that pops into your head. Merrilee has been politely answering your questions thus far, but I find your tone in the message above condescending. People here have been very patient with you Ken, but you will find that patience ending quickely if you expect us to jump for you. 

Moderate your tone. And you can also skip the "have a nice days" as they fool no one." 

 

KEN HUMMEL message posted on December 17, 2005 

"Mr. Howard: I have been quite polite, and have shown curtsey to everyone, and I will continue to do so. I expect to be treated in the same manor. Any suggestion that I have acted out of charactor and been condescending to anyone is indeed absurd. 

I will continue to be patient with Ms. Robson, CHF Canada's National Communications Officer. My thoughtful and well-reasoned questions are fair and valid. David, please explain to all the folks on Co-op Talk what you mean by asking me to moderate my tone. 

Have a nice day." 

 

KEN HUMMEL posted message on December 18, 2005 

"Mr. Wiseman: Thank you for the additional information, as this helps me narrow down a list of articles that you may be referring too. Bob, would you confirm or deny that the series by the Toronto Star, was "Housing millions down the drain" Published on May 20, 1995. 

 

Have a nice day" 

 

ROBERT A. WISEMAN posted message on December 18, 2005 

"Would I "...confirm or deny..." Ken? What is this - a cross examination? 

 

That sounds like the right series and the right time of printing." 

 

GINO GAMBOA posted message on December 19, 2005 

"jajaja...good one Bob..." 

 

JACKIE KENT posted message on December 28, 2005 

"A lot of complexity goes into the making of our personalities. It seems the meant to be pleasant phrase "Have a nice day" is not perceived as pleasing to all.

I have read different postings by Ken, and would not assume a judgment position on his value system by his posting techniques.

I do feel Ken has a handicap coming on to Co-op talk. He is a mere member with no board experience and a multitude of questions he would like answers to."...

"Perhaps this is why Ken has never sat on the board or he may feel he has more affect as the Co-op Watchdog or the group does not have the foresight of keeping their friends close and their enemies closer."..."Co-ops are not guaranteed to be successful because they use the educational tools or have paid staff."...

 

KEN HUMMEL posted message on December 30, 2005 

"Ms. Kent: If I have any "handicap coming on to Co-op Talk" it may result from a lack of understanding, respect or communication inside this forum with some of its participants. I have been a co-op member since 1992. People that know me personally or have been acquainted with me over the years, understand my dedication to the Co-op Principles, as an unpaid volunteer. I believe that I have served my co-op community with integrity, and have accomplished many tasks that my home co-op has benefited directly because of my aquired knowledge and skills. The co-op educational materials available to me over the years have been very helpful in accomplishing some of the difficult work as a "Watchdog" or someone that would scrutinize the ongoing business management of the co-op. 

 

Based on my observations, and communicating with other members from different co-ops, not enough members in this sector actively participate in this type of important work that may be the deciding factor that results in the success or possible failure of a housing co-op in this sector."

 

DIANE MILES posted message on January 16, 2006 

"Dear Ken,"...

 

"Your questions are quite reasonable. I will do my best to answer them in turn."... 

 

DAVID HOWARD message posted on January 16, 2006 

"After reading these postings and taking in to account the several warnings issued to Ken Hummel, I have decided to remove his posting privileges at this site. As many of you are aware, he was banned from the site earlier last year for bad behavior and then allowed back on condition that he take steps to not offend. He has failed to do this. It is my intention that his privileges will not be re-instated. 

 

I do not want this decision to chill the discussions here. Members should be aware that honest and respectful discussions are encouraged, even when they disagree with the majority opinion. Mr. Hummel was sent away because he could not find it within himself to treat others here with respect. Some of you may feel that we took too long to act. For this I apologize, but it does point out that we do not take these decisions lightly. 

 

If anyone disagrees with this decision, please refer to "Netiquette and Rules of Order" just to the left. These you will find the steps you can take to challenge this decision." 

 

ROBERT A. WISEMAN message posted on January 16, 2006 

"Dave, I think you bent over backwords for Ken and he just kept prodding and pushing boundaries. You did the only thing that you could in circumstances and you have my complete support." 

 

MARILYN GALLAGHER message posted on January 17, 2006 

"David, Thank you. I have not responded to any of Ken's postings. I was not prepared to waste my time and energy on someone who does not want to listen and is bent on causing trouble. I am so glad that we can now get back to doing what we do best, helping one another." 

 

 

Do #YouHoldtheKey that helps explain why a #CHFCanada #CoopHousingCrunch exist!    

   

Information may be revised, added or deleted without notification

Ken Hummel, Administrator, CHIE

 

   

CHF Canada...on Social Media

The Co-operative Housing Federation of Canada (CHF Canada) and it's Member Federation's have a social media presence on numerous web-pages that include Twitter.com, and Facebook.com...

CHF Canada, some of it's Member Federation's, and Co-op Housing Stakeholder's have blocked Ken Hummel from viewing tweets on their twitter account web-page and have tried to block Ken from interacting with their tweets posted on twitter.  Their efforts have not been successful.

CHF Canada also blocked Ken from joining and viewing their Facebook Group web-page "You Hold the Key - Fix the Co-op Housing Crunch" Site administered through CHF Canada. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Inclusiveness is not the mandate of CHF Canada for these web-pages, and member's of housing co-op's that are Member Co-op's of CHF Canada. They talk about being inclusive, but appear disingenuous and hypocrisy exist. Ken views, CHF Canada...as part of the 'Old Boy's & Girl's Co-op Housing Social Club'.

In Ken's view, CHF Canada is somewhat of a obscure group of lobbyist with little recognition or perhaps in some or many cases no support from the vast majority of individuals that reside in it's member housing cooperatives across Canada. 

Ken's mandate is transparency that shares information that raise awareness with views, and opinions on issues about the co-op housing sector that can be found on numerous social media websites and web-pages across Canada and the United States that welcome diverse views, opinions, and comments that are acceptable, and inclusiveness is defined as everyone.     

CHF Canada has an estimated 180,000 low, and moderate income household's residing in some 900 member housing co-operatives in 2017 with a membership portfolio that consist of high, mid, and low-rise apartments, townhouses, and houses across Canada.

CHF Canada joined twitter in March 2009 - webpage on twitter.com:

As at March 30, 2014 - 679 Followers

As as March 30, 2015 - 973 Followers

As at November 6, 2015 - 1,320 Followers 

As at April 2, 2019 - 3,073 Followers 

As at July 26, 2022 - 4,800 Followers

Nicholas Gazzard, Retired Executive Director, CHF Canada joined twitter in May 2012 - webpage on twitter.com: As at April 2, 2019 - 89 Followers 

As at July 26, 2022 - 80 Followers

CHF Canada has blocked Ken 'newmangoodmoon' Hummel from following their twitter web-page since at least December 27, 2014

 

 

 

 

 

 

CHF Canada's efforts have been unsuccessful. Ken decided starting in late March 2019 to block some CHF Canada staff, CHF follower's and/or CHF fed-head wanabee's that are the eyes and ears for CHF may be blocked from viewing or interacting on social media web-pages created by Ken that include twitter.com...

 

Tim Ross, Executive Director, CHF Canada attempted to block Ken from viewing his account at twitter.com 

 

Mr. Ross joined twitter in March 2009, and has 2,024 tweets; Following 1,267; and 1,430 Followers, as at April 2, 2019, and 1,745 Followers, as at July 26, 2022

 

Simone Swail, Manager, Government Relations, CHF Canada has attempted to block Ken from viewing her account at twitter.com

 

 

 Ms. Swail joined twitter in March 2009, and has 6,000 tweets; Following 1,193; and 1,091 Followers, as at April 2, 2019, and 1,300 Followers, as at July 26, 2022

 

The Agency for Co-operative Housing, CHF Canada's sole partner has attempted to block Ken from viewing their account at twitter.com 

 

The Agency for Co-operative Housing joined twitter in January 2019, and has 41 tweets; Following 193; 61 Followers as at April 2, 2019, and 554 Followers, as at July 26, 2022. 

 

Olga Tasci, Executive Director, the Agency twitter.com joined twitter in November 2017

As at July 26, 2022 - 19 Followers

 

Alexandra Wilson, former Executive Director, the Agency (retired) joined twitter in September 2012 twitter.com 

As at July 26, 2022 - 194 Followers

 

Ken 'newman_goodmoon' Hummel joined twitter in November 2009 - webpage on twitter.com:

As at November 15, 2014 - 600 Followers

As at March 30, 2015 - 982 Followers

As at November 6, 2015 - 1,503 Followers 

As at April 2, 2019 - 2,544 Followers 

As at July 26, 2022 - 2,446 Followers

The Co-operative Housing Federation of British Columbia (CHF BC). CHF BC is the voice for housing co-operatives in the Province of BC. CHF BC has some  243 member housing co-ops that have over 13,000 resident housing units.

CHF BC web-page on twitter.com:

As at December 27, 2014 - 478 Followers

As at November 6, 2015 - 601 Followers 

As at April 3, 2019 - 1,890 Followers 

As at July 26, 2022 - 2,999 Followers 

 

Thom Armstrong, Executive Director, CHF BC joined twitter in July 2019 twitter.com 

As at July 26, 2022 - 1,121 Followers

The Co-operative Housing Association of Eastern Ontario (CHASEO). CHASEO is the voice for housing co-ops in Eastern Ontario, Canada. CHASEO has a unpublished number of member co-ops.

CHASO web-page on twitter.com:

As at April 3, 2019 - 1,890 Followers 

As at July 26, 2022 - 1,491 Followers

The Co-operative Housing Federation of Toronto (CHFT) is the voice for housing co-operatives in the City of Toronto, Ontario. CHFT has about 160 member co-ops. Ken was blocked in 2017 from viewing the CHFT twitter web-page.

CHFT web-page on twitter.com:

As at November 6, 2015 - 147 Followers 

As at April 3, 2019 - 637 Followers 

As at July 26, 2022 - 1,060 Followers 

 

Tom Clement, Executive Director, CHFT, joined twitter in August 2011 twitter.com 

As at July 26, 2022 - 340 Followers

The Peel/Halton Co-operative Housing Federation is the local voice for housing co-operatives in the Region of Peel & Halton and Dufferin County. Peel/Halton CHF has about 31 member housing co-ops.

Peel/Halton CHF web-page on twitter.com:

As at November 6, 2015 -   232 Followers 

As at April 3, 2019 - 458 Followers 

As at July 26, 2022 - 518 Followers

The Central Ontario Co-operative Housing Federation (COCHF). COCHF is the voice for housing co-operatives in the Regions of Waterloo/Kitchener, Guelph, Cambridge and Brantford. COHO has about 38 member co-ops.

COCHO web-page on twitter.com:

As at April 3, 2019 - 18 Followers

As at July 26, 2022 - 20 Followers

The Toronto Community Housing Corporation (TCHC) has a portfolio of some 2,200 buildings including high, mid, and low rise apartments, townhouses, and houses providing homes to about 58,000 low and moderate income households.

TCHC web-page on twitter.com:

As at June 16, 2014 - 2,160 Followers

As at November 6, 2015 - 3,132 Followers 

As at April 3, 2019 - 6,341 Followers 

As at July 26, 2022 - 7,892 Followers

CHF Canada, and some of their Member Federations noted on Facebook.com:

CHF Canada web-page on facebook.com:

As at September 16, 2016 - 1,227 'people like this and 14 people have been here'

CHF Canada groups you hold the key web-page on facebook.com:

As at March 30, 2014 - 702 'Likes' and 66 'Talking about this

As at April 3, 2019 - 1,731 Likes and 1,851 follow

CHF British Columbia web-page on facebook.com:

As at September 16, 2016 - 671 'people like this and 7 people have been here' 

As at April 3, 2019 - 1,129 like and 1,259 follow

CHF Toronto web-page on facebook.com:

As at September 16, 2016 - 450 people like this and 5 people have been here 

As at April 3, 2019 - 1,025 like and 1,104 follow

CHF Peel/Halton web-page on facebook.com:

As at September 16, 2016 - 270 'people like this' 

As at April 3, 2019 - 367 like and 390 follow

CHF Central Ontario web-page on facebook.com:

As at September 16, 2016 - 226 'people like this and 1 person has been here' 

As at April 3, 2019 - 251 like and 283 follow

CHA Eastern Ontario web-page on facebook.com:

As at September 16, 2016 - 200 'people like this and 2 people have been here' 

As at April 3, 2019 - 388 like and 429 follow

Toronto Community Housing Corporation on facebook.com:

As at September 16, 2016 - 808 'people like this' 

As at April 3, 2019 - 2,062 like and 2,305 follow

In Ken's view, CHF Canada, and its Member Federation's are obscure lobbyist organizations that lobby for co-op housing with very little or no recognition or support from the vast majority of the some 180,000 individuals that reside in member housing co-op's across Canada.

National Rifle Association (NRA) web-page on facebook.com:

As at June 16, 2014 - 3.6 Million 'people like this'

As at Sept. 16, 2016 - 5,014,440 'people like this' 

As at April 3, 2019 - 5,071,690 like and 4,797,097 follow 

As at July 26, 2022 on twitter.com 881.7 K Followers

In Ken's view, the NRA is a lobbyist organization that has strong brand recognition and support from its Members...in the United States of America...

The likes, and talking about this on Facebook and followings on other social media platforms help Ken substantiate these claims about CHF Canada and their Member Federations!

Ken joined CHF Canada EOA Member Network, located on their own national website on June 23, 2014 and posted one message that day and one other message on July 5, 2014.

Ken posted two messages that contained factual information on the EOA Member Network. CHF Canada deleted Ken's two posted messages from the EOA Member Network. You can decide for yourself, if it was reasonable or fair to delete those two messages. 

Ken's two messages were recorded verbatim and are posted below for your review:

EOA Member Network - Topic: Opportunities

Ken Hummel: Posts: 2

Ken wrote on July 5, 2014: "Hi, Dan: You stated," (EOA Reply with Quote) "what exactly do you mean by "building for the future?"

Ken posted this message under EOA's auto generated quote from Dan:

"In my view, the Canadian non-profit co-operative housing sector has been on the long and winding road of self-destruction for over 40-years because of poor leadership from self-serving stakeholders...Perhaps it can be seen as bulding a bleak future for co-op housing for what I understand as its inherent problems..."

Ken posted this message on June 23, 2014 at the EOA Network:

"Good morning, Tony:

Bridlewood Co-operative Homes and its membership never had a chance to see the end of their operating agreement with CMHC because CHF Canada took the Co-op to Court, and the Co-op was liquidated, lost all of its assets to CHF Canada through purchase that was far below market value. It ceased to be a Co-op in October 212 and nearly two years has past."

"CHF Canada has not returned this non-profit housing project back to the status of Co-operative Housing. Could this be viewed as a failure on the non-proit co-operative housing model in Canada?"

"CHF Canada now want to partnership with government to develop 'Equity Co-op Housing' because the days of funding housing co-ops the way it used to be are over.

Have A Nice Day,

Ken 'newmangoodmoon' Hummel, Member, Athol Green Co-operative Homes Inc."

Ken received an email from CHF Canada on July 10, 2014 1:03:45 PM:

"EOA Member Network - Forum notification. New personal message."...

"Mr. Hummel, Please be advised that we have deleted your posts and disabled your account on our new EOA Members Network. Your messages are clearly meant to hurt CHF Canada's reputation and that of Canada's housing co-ops generally."

"Your previous exclusions from CHF Canada's messaging platforms (ie. Facebook and Co-op Talk) apply as well to this new bulletin board. Please do not attempt to re-register to use CHF Canada's member network.

Sincerely,

Scott Jackson, Programs Manager, National Communications CHF Canada"

Ken replied to Mr. Jackson's email. Ken's email in part stated the folowing:

In Ken's opinion, the Canadian non-profit co-op housing sector that includes CHF Canada as a major stakeholder can be viewed as pandering to the Board of Directors and Management Staff at its Member Housing Co-ops that can be seen as a contributing factor why poor or bad Governance and Management exist at some of their Member Co-ops.

The co-op housing sector has been in decline since about 1995 and that perhaps explain to everyone why CHF Canada has hurt or damaged their own reputation and credibility along with some of their member co-ops.

Ken received another email from CHF Canada on July 10, 2014 1:07:51 PM:

"EOA Member Network - Forum notification. Thread updated."...

"You are subscribed to a discussion thread, which has been updated. "New Users" - "Opportunities" - From Scott Jackson"

"PLEASE NOTE: Several messages on this topic stream were deleted because they were outside the range of respectful and constructive discourse. For guidelines on goo netiquette, please visit the FAQ section from the link at the top of this page, And if you have any questions or concerns, please feel free to contact CHF Canada's Program Manager, National Communications, Scott Jackson"...

Ken was banned for life on Jan. 16, 2006 from CHF Canada's 'co-op talk' that was a messaging board established in 2000 for co-op housing stakeholders to communicate issues...that was located on their national website. CHF Canada deactivated co-op talk in March 2013 due to very low participation.

You can review some of the archived messages posted on co-op talk: CLICK HERE 

 

It should be noted that most of the information posted in this blog was migrated from Ken's 'KeepAndShare' Account prior to, and up to September 2017 

Information may be revised and/or deleted without prior notification

Ken Hummel, Administrator, CHIE

Co-op Housing Crunch

Some information is hyper-linked. Some information is currently under review and some links may be broken at this point in-time.

 

From the Archives of CHF Canada - Co-op Talk, and some selected posted messages for your review:

JODI SHAW posted message on January 2, 2013

"Okay I will try to not make this too long. I have lived in our co-op for 6 years. Upon moving in I discovered we were always in financial trouble but managed to keep ourselves going. We have 5 years left on our mortgage."

"In the past year our co-op has completely fallen apart. We have 15 vacate units right now, people are up and leaving without giving notice leaving their shares. They are fed up with mold issues, roofing issues, and the board which is basically run by two people."

"Rules are being changed without our consent. Board members are emailing in camera minutes to each other and board minutes to each other which is so not right. Rules are not being followed. Examples: A member requested our maintence helper (another member) not come into her  to fix her hot water tank because he is not a certified plumber."

He brought his kids while working whom she had to babysit. While she went to work a board member unlocked her door and let this member (maintence guy) in to do the work without her consent. At the members meeting she was irate with this and brought it up and our Board dismissed it!"

"So yeah stuff like that is going on. Several of us left have called CMHC and CHFBC for help we get none. We recently discovered that all our shared have been used now for the operating costs of our co-op without our consent. Our bills last month were barely paid, basically we had 2000 left over."

"Many of us believe we are finished and wish to dissolve the co-op so we can get back some of what we put into this. I paid $1800 to get in and probably won't be given back to me. People are also being allowed to live here owing more than their shares before being given a 1030 to vacate."

"Does anyone have any suggestions on this. 3 people just up and moved this past weekend leaving their shares behind because they just don't want to deal with the crap in here. That's how bad it is. I am sad because a year ago families lived here and my kids had friends to play with. Now it's lonely and sad seeing all these people leave and nobody doing anything about it."

RONALD SCHLAMP posted message on June 30, 2009

"As I learn more about the Rules and Acts governing our Coop specifically our, by-laws and Coops in general, Coop Act, Incorporated Business Act, the National Housing Act, the Society Act, the Residential Tenancy Act, Governing Legislations, Program Rules, etc., I am seeing red flags going up all around me."

"Some of my concerns are the President acting like she owns the Company and her word is the final say on everything, including 1/ making decisions outside the Boardroom that countermand decisions made by the whole Board without any discussion with anyone in, or out of the Boardroom"

"2/ Siding with her friends in conflicts with other Members or Directors and settling the conflict by domination and intimidation, many times without even involving the other party in the conflict"

"3/ she has two good friends on the Board and they believe they can do anything they want around the Coop because they can go to her for such overpowering decisions as were made in the second example ( the daughter of one of her Director friends yelled out " she can do anything she F___ing wants around here during a disagreement with one other Member"

"4/ one or more of these 3 Directors have stayed in power past their "no longer than 6 consecutive years without stepping down for at least one year" terms"

"5/ the President has a Company staffed by friends who get most of the jobs around our Coop without other bids being tendered, and when others suggest they know a Company that can do the job cheaper they are ignored"

"6/ other Directors are fearful of speaking out against these  3 or 4"

"7/ when I approached the President with my concerns about not running the Coop according to the rules I was told by her that this wouldn't work because no one follows rules around here ( no wonder to me why now ) I now see that these few Directors spend the money on the things they want, most spending with no input from the Board, and just like the contractor situation, when other Directors do talk with her when they do hear she is buying something ( like the 2 brand new benches used mostly only by these few Directors and one of their friends ),"

"their alternative suggestions are not taken seriously, nor are they considered at a Board Meeting, as I feel they should be) This is just a smattering of the problems I see here at my Coop - there are many , many more including a general apathy amoungst the Members, anarchic behavior from some of the youth, fear of these Directors from many and resentment from many others."

"I, myself, am the newest member of this Coop (2 yrs. - 1 yr. on the Board ), 2nd newest on the Board, so have not rightly determined all of the Directors loyalties. I know there are the President and her 2 friends that back each other on anything, then I have only really talked to one of the other 3 and she agrees with my summations, but believes it better to bury the head like an ostrich rather than chance trouble."

"I have yet to talk to the other two alone to determine if they are interested in voting to rescue the Coop from these Coopnappers. Do any of you see any other way than what a CHF rep told me was the only way to regain the hijacked power, through majority Board decisions."

"Can not any Rules and regs be applied from any Acts or Rules at all without a Board decision to apply them? Just in case I cannot gain a majority yet to get our Coop back in the hands of the shareholders I would like to know my alternatives , if any. Thanx people"

TERESA BARCLAY-KUCZERYK posted message on April 11, 2009

"Hi, My name is Teresa & I have just found this site after a VERY upsetting AGM. I am on the internet trying to get information on the rights of the general members on dispute with the board of directors. if anyone here can help I & my fellow co-op members would GREATLY appreciate it!"

..."Here is our problem: We live in a rather large cooperative housing community . Larger than what would be average with 107 townhouse units. We have approximately 10 units that are affected with a drainage issue. ALL in the same block, & on the same side of our co-op."

"During our Nov. AGM we collectively agreed to hire a professional to access the issue. Tonight our members were informed that the contractor has suggested that ALL gardens & fences must be removed at our cost...grading will then be done & swills will be installed. We were then informed that once the work is completed the BOARD has decided that we will NOT be permitted to have our gardens OR Fences again! Our current policies allow for both...we are also one of the few co-ops that allow pets."

"**I should also say here that we HAVE done this SAME drainage solution 3 times prior in our 20 year history & each time this solution DID NOT solve the issue. We have SEVERAL professional members (Landscapers, Contractors & Plumbers) currently living in our co-op. We do have other options that we were not permitted to explore.***"

"...We were also informed that because we voted to have the assessment done the general members no longer have a say as to the work that will be done & all of this will begin despite any objections to the contrary. However after requesting to see where in our Nov. minutes this was stated - the board could not provide any documentation to support this."

"Naturally, the majority of our members were very upset about this! We DID have a member of CHF there. However she refused to answer our questions, & skirted any enquires as to our rights in the matter."

"For example: after after much debate, one of our members suggested we postpone the work to be done until we can hold another meeting to discuss ALL  member concerns & issues. This suggestion was not answered & the board moved on with the discussion."

"We were then told that we could NOT discuss this with our board & must direct ALL further questions to the CHF rep. The rep told us that the board can make ANY & ALL decisions in regards to the co-op including changing policies & did NOT need to get the approval of the general members."

"After which she answered EVERY further inquiry with "Ok - we here you. Any other questions?", and would promptly move on. This continued until I pointedly told her that we had asked the question 3 times already; Can the members request that all work be suspended until we have the time to research other options & collectively discuss & vote?"

"She then told us that she was unsure - but believed that we had NO rights to request this & told us that despite our objections the work would continue as planed. She also stated that she is here to help the board NOT the general members."

"Also I should mention that 3 out of the 6 current board members also had questions & concerns & did not seem to AGREE with the CHF member or president of our board."

"My question is this...What ARE the member's rights in a matter such as this? The majority of us do NOT want to continue like this & would like to make sure our voices are heard. Any questions?"...

"Teresa

Concerned Co-op Member"

JASON SMITH posted message on March 14, 2008

"Hi my name is Jason Smith my room mate and I moved to spruce housing co-op last april and were really looking forward to participating in life at a co-op."...

"They had their AGM just prior to our moving in so we moved in with a new board."...

"unfortunatly the the current board (some still have stayed on as some positions are 2 yrs) has also fractured and divided ours as well, amoung other problems. I believe we are also a co-op in crisis . maintenance requests were/are being ignored for months and in some cases longer."

"they are rude to people who are not in their small circle and to top it off 2 of them have been having an affair that has split 2 familes and they have been keeping a unit free for their "private meetings" that should have been rented out mths ago (it has been vacant 3.5 mths now). they have also givin contracts for windows and parking to companies, members family members work for or own who are also board members."

"they also keep bringing in Thom Armstrong from the co-op housing federation of BC to chair meetings so that we cant question them on these issues. they (the board) have decided that the meetings and elections are going to be done by the book, which wasnt exactly how things were done here for many years here but it worked and was legal, they elected a member to each position where now the elected board decides and questions were allowed about issues."

"Thom kept shutting us down and at one point told us that the legislation we were asking about was wrong and that was it."

"if its legislated isnt it right until it is changed? and yes some people got angry but never out of control. they also neglected to tell us it is costing the co-op 255$ per meeting for him as well. we has to bring that up at the meeting."

"we feel like we are just being trampled upon and we dont know where to turn. can you help us in any way? some advice or somewhere, someone to turn to? thanks for reading, Jason Smith, Spruce Housing co-op"  

JASON SMITH posted message on March 18, 2008

"i recieved an email today from thom armstrong saying that he will continue to let me rant but if i misquoted him again he would not take the same approach. I did not misquote him , he told us the legislation was wrong on an issue and a room full of people heard him and i can provice 25+ witnesses to the fact."

"I thought this was supposed to be a safe place to ask for help when problems arise, obviously it is not. I thank the people who emailed me with some useful advice but now im worried that he is going to blab to the board what ive written and that they will conveniently leave out of the minutes what was said by him."

TAMRA NOBLE posted message on January 2, 2008 

 

"Hello I am the new property manager for Place Aile Nord. This is my first time doing this type of work I have been at it now for about 3 months I think that I may be getting the hang of some of it. Any advise for a newby." 

 

 

 

ROBERT A. WISEMAN posted message on January 2, 2008 

 

"Hi Tamra. Welcome to the sector and to Co-op Talk. At this point, I would urge you not to hesitate to ask questions. You can get los of support from your colleagues [us].

 

 

 

FRED GERRIOR posted message on April 28, 2006

"Has anyone heard about a coordinator ripping off two co-ops in Hamilton?"

"Apparently $270,000.00 was allegedly stolen and I don't see any topic on how these misappropriations happened."

"And to think this coordinator called me a liar at GM meetings and board meetings - unbelievable!" 

 

 

 

BRYNNE TEAL posted message on April 6, 2005 

 

"I will be blunt. I feel very uncomfortable when I see particular Boards or members or staff pilloried for the problems (whether real or perceived) that exist in their co-ops."

 

"I have cringed and/or been angered by some of the postings and feel that some of them have been on the verge of being libellous. It doesn't matter if people aren't named. Many of us still know who is being referred to."

 

"I do not think it's fair in a forum like this to belittle people or destroy their reputations. I do not think it is right that accusations of graft and corruption are posted unless they have been confirmed by an auditor, lawyer or funder and/or have been proven in a court of law."

 

"And even then why dwell on the past? Work hard to fix the problems and get procedures in place right quick so it doesn't happen again. I don't like wasting my time getting together information, that the posting was really just a ruse."

 

"I don't like hidden agendas - again a huge waste of time for people who come on Co-op Talk IN GOOD FAITH to get and share information and news. Okay - blunt but not brief."   

 

 

 

PERNELL DUCHAINE posted message on November 20, 2005 

 

..."the BOD does act with the help of a staff person. They are what we call new because our elections were held in May. Some of the directors have been on the BOD before, others their first time."

 

"There have been many a time that the BOD have been sent for the purpose of getting better educated as a Board. However we have not seen the benefits of these workshops. The membership is in total agreement that there should be 7 new people on our Board."

 

"We also agree that the current coordinator of our Co-op should be let go or transferred. Members have been treated with the utmost disrespect and rudeness from all parties. This particular BOD and staff member just recently tried to evict a member who has never been late with rent, has kept his unit in tip top shape and who has been an active member until he became ill recently."

 

"Their reason was his behaviour at our last General Membership Meeting when we were all brought together to approve the proposed budget. When asked if the membership had any questions he raised his hand...this is where we are all confused...no one was able to answer his questions pertaining to the budget, instead the coordinator got defensive and our VP told this particular member in front of all the members that he had an attitude problem and he was being disruptive."

 

"We did not agree about this he was simply asking valid questions, which were not answered to anyone's satisfaction. They stated in the reasons for his eviction, that his behaviour was unaccepable...I snicker at this because if this were the case then all 6 members of the BOD should have been up for eviction as well. Ouer co-op has 46 units and it is getting increasingly hard to live here, according to the BOD if you voice your opinion you will have to face them for eviction. Not Right!!?" 

 

 

 

MERRILEE ROBSON posted message on November 21, 2005 

 

"Hi Pernell. As one of the moderators of this discussion area, I'd like to draw your attention to the Netiquette area of Co-op Talk. We like to point this out to new participants."

 

"It's perfectly acceptable to ask questions and get advice from other members about how to request a meeting. But we discourage personal remarks about board members and staff."...

 

 

 

ROBERT A. WISEMAN posted message on November 21, 2005 

 

"Pernell, with all due respect, it is not fair for you to post disparaging comments about your fellow co-op members and your staff person on this forum."...

 

 

 

PERNELL DUCHAINE posted message on November 22, 2005 

 

"I'm sorry, I didn't realize that I was acting improper. I was under the impression that I would be able to ask questions about concerns we have. I am educated and have lived here for 5 years and have seen Boards come and go."

 

"Now when you say that I am not in full possession of all the facts, you are mistaken...I have spent much time studying our by-laws, Social reform act and Co-op acts, I do realize they are human...we all are...but when by-laws are being broken and it is staff and the BOD who are breaking them does the membership just have to sit back and let it happen."

 

"I'm not trying to bash them I am simply trying to get some help from what better place than here. If I was out of line, then I apologize...I will no longer post here, but I would like you to know that we have called all over and have e-mailed so many people and we as a membership...and I am speaking for our membership under their request...all agree that we have no rights, we feel our hands are tied. We were a community once, nothing has ever been done to me or my family, but I feel I must do my part to make sure it stays that way."   

 

 

 

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Ken Hummel, Administrator, CHIE